StarForce > Starforce Nightmare

[Optimummind]

It seems like despite the much bragging in the readme for SNF, StarForce has triumphed.

Here's the readme quote:

You see, to create this program you need deep expert knowledge of hardware
architecture and as you see, we have it, else this program wouldn't exist.
All, what I want to say with, my opinion described above is not just yeasty words, it is
reality.

It's been almost two weeks and no crack or override for Splinter Cell Chao Theory's Starforce.

Although I hate them for not allowing me to backup my copy, those Starforce guys sure are pretty smart.

[DABhand]

Not that difficult to write a VB/c++/ASM program to disable/remove specific hardware and channels.

That is basically all it is at the end of the day.

[kosmiq]

They just wants to feel l33t so that all beginners (aka n00bs) can think that those guys are sooo cool so they can be someones hero.

The fellas at Starforce should really be honored for creating such a good protection. Sure it has it drawbacks and compatibility problems, still it does what it is supposed to do. Protect the games from becoming warez.
One of the major drawbacks it peoples ability to make personal backups of their games. When I buy a game for $50 I want to be able to backup it.
Thats why I don't own any other SF3 games than Soldiers Heroes of WW2 (because it is fun!).
And the drivers getting installed with the protection ain't my thing.
Guess I'll have to live with it since SecuROM uses similar drivers now...

[Luci]

well it's a clever protection but it writes some files to your pc disableing some programs...

[Karthik 2.0]

Man, all this thing is getting way to real. It's like those scifi movies with huge corparation that dominate human thoughts!

[Luciel]

:d

[Bru_Master]

Follow Chris Griffin's words!!!::::

FIGHT THE MACHINE!!!!


......."How do you know about the machine?"


this SF thing is getting kinda weird....what if all games go to it cause they know hackers n crackers cant get past it ....yet...<evil Mannoroth laugh>

....C'MON Daemon Tools v4!!!!

The whole thing almost kinda makes you wanna get off your ass and do something about it.....yupp....suuuuuuuure does.....

[DABhand]

DTv4 will work to a degree but not 100%, then when it seems its winning, along comes a new SF protection, and so on and so forth.

[vharshyde]

Originally Posted by kosmiq

They just wants to feel l33t so that all beginners (aka n00bs) can think that those guys are sooo cool so they can be someones hero.

...I want to be able to backup it.

Forgive my laughter.

Now, as for the CD copy protection types, well, they arent really winning. The whole bit about warez is that they pften provide a 95% gameplay ability, meaning that some bug prevents a certain level of the game from working properly in the no-cd/dvd patch. This does not go for all games, naturally, but it does go for a goodly portion of them. Game manufacturers NEED people to pirate games, as few are going to spend 50 bucks cash on something they havent even seen a commercial for.

Besides, give it a week or so. Someone will make a patch, or another program to knock out the protection system. You forget. There might be a few different protection systems, but there's millions, dare I say a couple billion people on the net who're more than happy to put something together. Just like they always have. Some of these guys have been around for around 20 years on the net, providing cracked copy protection, CD recognition, and otherwise. Even back when games required you to look on page x, line x of your manual and type in word x, these guys would go into the game code, and knock that out.

Never underestimate the power of the internet. What a company spends a few years developing, the bio-cybermass that is the net can destroy in a matter of days.

[caki]

True, but Starforce has changed all that. Its takwn months, maybe even years to learn how to generically crack.

Sure, there will always be people around to hack all this new ****... For now. If the FBI actually had a strong motive to catch warez useres, well... I doubt this board would be here, and the scene as active as it is.

Sure some of the guys have been around for 20 years on the net cracking their asses off, but they gotta retire some time, dont they? And what happens then?

Also, protections are getting better and better. Hell, the starforce people are lazy, but I bet they could easily add a couple of new features to their protection to make it hell to RE... as if it already isnt.

So many uknowns... I wouldnt even start these types of discussions. We cant predict anything. Whats there is there, use it. Learn. Dont rely on other people to do everything for you. Do it on your own.

For example: look at the D-tools people. I wouldnt be surprised if a millions people used their soft. What happens if they get sued? Oh no we're ****ed? Some other guys will come along, true, but how long will it take for them to get to the same level as D-tools? Or, will they be busted and hounded from Day 1??

We have no way to know. My philosophy is to appreciate things while you have them. I appreciate D-tools, I appreciate Softice, and all the other nice little things people have cooked up for us. If I want something, I make it instead of waiting for it. Sometimes I dont have the skills to make it. I then acquire them... and so on forever. People in my opinion should do that instead of whining for the next D-tools release of Reloadeds next Starforce crack, or when Fairlight is gonna retun to the scene... If you don't have time to learn... well thats too bad. But I've never not had time for anything. And, god willing, it shall stay this way.

I'm saying this vharshyde because I totally disagree with your viewpoint. One day, the flow will stop. Then its up to you if you want to continue an upstream battle or bail out.

Enough bull****. I have math homework to finish.

-rendari

[DABhand]

Originally Posted by vharshyde

Forgive my laughter.

Now, as for the CD copy protection types, well, they arent really winning. The whole bit about warez is that they pften provide a 95% gameplay ability, meaning that some bug prevents a certain level of the game from working properly in the no-cd/dvd patch. This does not go for all games, naturally, but it does go for a goodly portion of them. Game manufacturers NEED people to pirate games, as few are going to spend 50 bucks cash on something they havent even seen a commercial for.

Besides, give it a week or so. Someone will make a patch, or another program to knock out the protection system. You forget. There might be a few different protection systems, but there's millions, dare I say a couple billion people on the net who're more than happy to put something together. Just like they always have. Some of these guys have been around for around 20 years on the net, providing cracked copy protection, CD recognition, and otherwise. Even back when games required you to look on page x, line x of your manual and type in word x, these guys would go into the game code, and knock that out.

Never underestimate the power of the internet. What a company spends a few years developing, the bio-cybermass that is the net can destroy in a matter of days.

What you forget is, it was easier way back then, but now its more sophisticated, hell some "crackers" are getting younger each year and they dont have the experience like the old time ones once had. So protections will eventually win.

[hyakkii]

Originally Posted by rendari

True, but Starforce has changed all that. Its takwn months, maybe even years to learn how to generically crack.

Sure, there will always be people around to hack all this new ****... For now. If the FBI actually had a strong motive to catch warez useres, well... I doubt this board would be here, and the scene as active as it is.

Sure some of the guys have been around for 20 years on the net cracking their asses off, but they gotta retire some time, dont they? And what happens then?

Also, protections are getting better and better. Hell, the starforce people are lazy, but I bet they could easily add a couple of new features to their protection to make it hell to RE... as if it already isnt.

So many uknowns... I wouldnt even start these types of discussions. We cant predict anything. Whats there is there, use it. Learn. Dont rely on other people to do everything for you. Do it on your own.

For example: look at the D-tools people. I wouldnt be surprised if a millions people used their soft. What happens if they get sued? Oh no we're ****ed? Some other guys will come along, true, but how long will it take for them to get to the same level as D-tools? Or, will they be busted and hounded from Day 1??

We have no way to know. My philosophy is to appreciate things while you have them. I appreciate D-tools, I appreciate Softice, and all the other nice little things people have cooked up for us. If I want something, I make it instead of waiting for it. Sometimes I dont have the skills to make it. I then acquire them... and so on forever. People in my opinion should do that instead of whining for the next D-tools release of Reloadeds next Starforce crack, or when Fairlight is gonna retun to the scene... If you don't have time to learn... well thats too bad. But I've never not had time for anything. And, god willing, it shall stay this way.

I'm saying this vharshyde because I totally disagree with your viewpoint. One day, the flow will stop. Then its up to you if you want to continue an upstream battle or bail out.

Enough bull****. I have math homework to finish.

-rendari

I wasn't going to reply to this BUT i am bored, Daemon tools can't be sued since they aren't based in the usa ( I think germany if i recall right ) and they are doing nothing wrong to be sued for d-tools has MANY legit uses.
Thats like saying rarlabs can be sued since most illegal softs are distributed in that format, OR gamecopyworld/cdmediaworld/fileforums/megagames could be sued for hosting cracked / disasembled / rev engineered exe's ..etc as long as there serves a legal and legit use there shouldn't be any sue'ing going on .


On to the starforce protection
I don't like it but i do support it in a way since it does its job really good looking at the numbers (don't ask where) it severly cut back on pirate copys sure some people can get them to work still using really inconvenient methods but the average pc user this can turn into a catastorphy and they end up buying the game! (woohoo)..

The downside is as some people said making personal backups and drivers that get installed / compatability

so i am for it since it boosts their sales and now maybe they can start making quality games again while saving the pc gaming industry (consoles are about to completely take over pc gaming) i think the pirate scene has gotten waaaay out of hand and i think even the pirate groups realize it

people complain about the protections but in reality if people didn't steal games it wouldnt have gone this far

who knows maybe next will be something like the riaa called the spaa ( i wouldnt support anything like that since most of the time the information they collect is inaccurate and sue the wrong person)& all internet privacy gone policed and moderated, Im sure it will happen sooner or later but for now I personally would rather have starforce

[Joe Forster/STA]

Internet is free speech. Warezers use it, pedophiles use it, terrorists use it. So what?

Five hundred years ago, a guy named Gutenberg came up with a printer machine; monks, who had the monopoly of knowledge and copying books, were f*cked but pretty much the whole mankind profited from it. So what?

A few decades ago, computers penetrated the average households. People started using game and productivity software for their own purposes and fun. Then some companies came up with devices that allow you to make your own copies of software. Now software publishers are f*cked but pretty much the whole mankind profits from it. So what?

A few centuries later, someone will come up with what we call a "replicator" in Star Trek: a device that can duplicate any physical object, given an original object (or its digitized pattern) and enough energy/matter. Then originals will have no value as everyone will be able to have a perfect duplication of them. Collectors will be f*cked but pretty much the whole mankind will profit from it. So what?

[caki]

Originally Posted by hyakkii

I wasn't going to reply to this BUT i am bored, Daemon tools can't be sued since they aren't based in the usa ( I think germany if i recall right )

I'm not sure, but in Germany if you do ANYTHING to bypass copy proctections they can sue you. Its much stricter that in the US. CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG. I AM NOT SURE.

[hyakkii]

Originally Posted by rendari

I'm not sure, but in Germany if you do ANYTHING to bypass copy proctections they can sue you. Its much stricter that in the US. CORRECT ME IF I AM WRONG. I AM NOT SURE.

I am unsure if they are from germany or canada or someother place in an very old email of mine SwENSkE (i think he was the original maker of d-tools) said something about germany so i wasnt 100% sure if he was talking about where he was or another company .. and im not even sure if he is the current developer or associated with the project anymore.