Caesar IV - Mini-Image HELP

[Havoclivekiller]

It worked before.... but now after restart it says what the rest is saying "Please insert original instead of backup"

[monkeymajik]

Worked for me, obviously with the mini image etc but it worked first time after changing my DVD to something like K.....

[maciozo]

This discussion here only confirms that the issues are the effect of bad configuration and/or anti-blacklisting techniques used rather than the MI. To those that still have problems i've made a list of what to do to have the MI working at least in more cases (for me it's a flawless 100% runtime no matter if using a full or a mini image of CIV and other SecuROM 7 games).

1. Delete or reinstall Alcohol 120% - DON'T INSTALL IT'S DRIVER IN THE DEVICE MANAGER! Also make sure you're installing the LATEST version as this program is very sensitive to blacklsting.
2. Install LATEST (4.06 ATM) Daemon Tools, enable ALL options (DT will autoset anyways) & set it's letter PRIOR to the real drives (I've found this useful when having discs put in those)
3. Install LATEST BlindWrite (6.0.0.18 ATM) & enabled EZ-Play (this is an anti-blacklister which works permamently).
4. Open Pr0t.St0p & click Hide (it will mask registry entries of all SCSI devices including DT).
5. Launch PROCYON's Loader (also known as SecuROM v7.26 Loader) and select game's EXE
OR
Use the latest CureROM - it will create a special profile, which will fully automate mounting & launching process.

* Also, make sure you don't running any crap as Nero ImageDrive, CloneDrive and other unuseful & outdated apps.

** This is a full overkill method, if it doesn't work for you, verify your configuration and update your software - it's a very crucial point.

[TippeX]

1. Delete or reinstall Alcohol 120% - DON'T INSTALL IT'S DRIVER IN THE DEVICE MANAGER! Also make sure you're installing the LATEST version as this program is very sensitive to blacklsting.

huh? dont install the driver in device manager, how the hell is it going to work then?

2. Install LATEST (4.06 ATM) Daemon Tools, enable ALL options (DT will autoset anyways) & set it's letter PRIOR to the real drives (I've found this useful when having discs put in those)

Odd, when the dt developers on their own forum say you dont need to enable all the options, infact they recommend to turn them off

3. Install LATEST BlindWrite (6.0.0.18 ATM) & enabled EZ-Play (this is an anti-blacklister which works permamently).

actually ez-play is just blindwrites renamed autoplay driver.. it does not anti-blacklist as you state.. if you dont believe me right click on the driver and select properties .. see 'autoplay' mentioned?...

4. Open Pr0t.St0p & click Hide (it will mask registry entries of all SCSI devices including DT).
5. Launch PROCYON's Loader (also known as SecuROM v7.26 Loader) and select game's EXE
OR
Use the latest CureROM - it will create a special profile, which will fully automate mounting & launching process.

using multiple anti blacklisting tools is ...

Really a bad idea, they are all variations on a theme, and using multiple ones can only increase the chances of something bad (or unexpected) happening

Totally overkill method, and also ill advised...

[Joe Forster/STA]

Originally Posted by TippeX

Odd, when the dt developers on their own forum say you dont need to enable all the options, infact they recommend to turn them off

Our forum FAQ also suggests ENabling all the emulation options. Do you think this should be changed now? Please, confirm. (Sorry, I don't have time to keep reading all the news around anymore... ) Thanks!

[Velusion]

Originally Posted by maciozo

This discussion here only confirms that the issues are the effect of bad.

I've followed all your suggestions here to no avail. Like most people here - the game worked the very first time, but now will not start. I can use these blacklisting tools just fine on other titles....

[maciozo]

Really, I have no time to argue with such posts written just "art-for-art".
So, one more time:
1. Alcohol at it's setup installs an SCSI driver which is nothing other than the virtual device driver. In many of mine cases deleting it helped getting SR7 games to work. It has nothing to do with the program itself - burning, reading, DPM work just fine.
2. That's just bloat talk - you can do either, as I mentioned DT will auto set itself anyways.
3. Write to VSO then if you don't believe me. If it's just an autoplay driver, why it would generate a random device name & even a device category? Please take a closer look. Extract from the guide about EZ-Play (it's a bit outdated but the main idea is the same): http://www.portmac.com/modules.php?name=BlindWrite6_Guide&file=EzPlay
4. All of those anti-blacklisters aren't harmful for the system so you can use them safely (Pr0t.St0p + SecuROM v7.26 Loader OR CureROM only).

Another point for CIV - if using SecuROM v7.26 Loader you must rather point CaesarIV.exe than civexec.exe (of course you can try both).

The game was released on CDs only which is another thing that complicates the whole process - SecuROM works way better with such editions and it can detect backup/mini images more often than in DVD editions cases.

Concluding, when it comes to SecuROM, you must work your own method. If you need future help, consult this thread at NFOrce:
http://nforce.nl/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24012&postdays=0&postorder=asc&sta rt=90
Maybe some techniques posted there will work for you better?

[monkeymajik]

I followed the basic steps earlier in the thread and nothing worked till I changed the drive letter then it gave in and ran!!!

It is always best to have the latest versions of everything but I did nothing more than what was explained earlier.

Keep tryin

[Zulu]

Originally Posted by TippeX

actually ez-play is just blindwrites renamed autoplay driver..

Of course you're right, but to be fair to VSO: They did not only rename but it uses a whole new architecture.

@maciozo
Maybe you should write to VSO to ask what's the effect of EZ-Play on a mounted image/virtual drive.
And as TippeX stated: it does not anti-blacklist, but it's prepared not to be easily blacklisted

[TippeX]

Originally Posted by Joe Forster/STA

Our forum FAQ also suggests ENabling all the emulation options. Do you think this should be changed now? Please, confirm. (Sorry, I don't have time to keep reading all the news around anymore... ) Thanks!

yup.. some snippets from their forum

"And, by the way, emulation protections are useless when using an image. DT decides alone what it wanna emulate"

"You should NOT need to turn any emulation options on when only using a Virtual CD-ROM/DVD-ROM Drive. That's really only for inserted CD's that you've made burned backup copies onto."

(http://www.daemon-tools.cc/dtcc/show...urn+options%22)

from one of their beta team...

perhaps it only applies for dt 4.x or above, but yep the faq might need updating joe

[TippeX]

1. Alcohol at it's setup installs an SCSI driver which is nothing other than the virtual device driver. In many of mine cases deleting it helped getting SR7 games to work. It has nothing to do with the program itself - burning, reading, DPM work just fine.

alcohol installs as a scsi driver and a pnp extender...perhaps what you might be talking about is just letting sptd.sys install... ?

2. That's just bloat talk - you can do either, as I mentioned DT will auto set itself anyways.

Hardly bloat when it comes from their own beta team

3. Write to VSO then if you don't believe me. If it's just an autoplay driver, why it would generate a random device name & even a device category? Please take a closer look. Extract from the guide about EZ-Play (it's a bit outdated but the main idea is the same): http://www.portmac.com/modules.php?n...de&file=EzPlay

it is autoplay, albeit as mentioned its new, the driver renaming (and/or hiding) is just an attempt by them to avoid blacklisting of their components..

4. All of those anti-blacklisters aren't harmful for the system so you can use them safely (Pr0t.St0p + SecuROM v7.26 Loader OR CureROM only).

nah, remember antiblaxx? it was pretty damned harmful, using 2 or more anti blacklisters could counteract the other blacklisters effectiveness.. if one works on your system stick with it.. using more is for sure a recipe for disaster..

Another point for CIV - if using SecuROM v7.26 Loader you must rather point CaesarIV.exe than civexec.exe (of course you can try both).

yep, pointing the anti blacklisting tool at the proper exe and not a launcher does increase the potential for it working...

Concluding, when it comes to SecuROM, you must work your own method. If you need future help, consult this thread at NFOrce:

agreed, each pc is different, so people must find their own solution, which is why i commented on your 'throw everything including the kitchen sink at the program to get it working' post.


and its not an 'art-for-art' reply... its active criticism

[maciozo]

to be absolutely honest with you, i love cynism - especially when it's hardly perceptible. but this time it wasn't. i bet you can do better though.
anyways, trying to be on the track. my list of recommended steps described as 'throw everything including the kitchen sink at the program to get it working' was written to give people a big picture what they can do about SR7-protected games. i've spent many hours learning SecuROM behavior in certain circumstances & different program combinations. i didn't encounter a single problem with suggested anti-blacklisters (LOL, i knew you would dig out anti-blaxx, just for the art or arguing).

"yep, pointing the anti blacklisting tool at the proper exe and not a launcher does increase the potential for it working..." as on the mentioned nforce thread, not always.

agreed, each pc is different, so people must find their own solution, which is why i commented on your 'throw everything including the kitchen sink at the program to get it working' post.
i like that we can all discuss & benefit from it, but this time i really cannot figure out what was the whole point of this (the meaning of this sentence is also unclear to me, but maybe that's my lack of english).

greetz,
and yes, i'll write to VSO

[Grumpy]

@maciozo

'throw everything including the kitchen sink at the program to get it working'

Translates too:
"try anything and everything available to get the program working."

[maciozo]

i've managed to get the context, but thanks anyways

[TippeX]

didnt really cite anti blaxx as a reason for argument (wasn't arguing either.. was just discussing).. i could have cited others, like the subinacl one, and i consider anti blacklisting programs that destroy registry keys (albeit the mounteddevices one should be rebuilt on bootup).

Some anti blacklist programs are better than others.. the vast majority in the beginning all revolved round deleting/setting privileges on registry keys.. some of the later ones (curerom, asr etc) do api hooking and dll injection.. they are ALL variations on the same theme, with slight differences.

Because of this there is a possiblity that running 2 together is detrimental to the game... even those using api hooks do NOT unhook once the oep of the executable is reached, but remain resident throughout the entire game running, which can cause problems (esp. when some of the hooks are pretty badly coded... curerom v1 for example)..

The 2 main contenders for anti blacklisting seem to be curerom and pr0t.st0p (which is antique).. and generally most people seem to find success using curerom..

My main 'gripe' is that using multiple programs (which essentially do the same thing) leads to confusion as/when/if you find the solution as you dont really know what helped to get the game running, which defeats the entire purpose of posting 'hints'..

It should also be mentioned that when finding solutions its best to reboot, and try your solution again, as some of the anti blacklisting programs do not unload in some cases.. so you technically have a 'corrupt' system..

"oh look, i kicked my pc, moved the mouse, looked out the window, drank some coke,prayed a little, crossed my fingers, put the original disk in, and the game loaded... now i wonder what caused it to work.." (i reckon it was the coke ;p) (see my point?)