REQ: Stolen trainers to be removed from GCW

[BigBoi]

(See the premises.)

maybe because Kelsat is a ripper hackjob that has no real talent other than using the copy/paste function? just a guess.

[DABhand]

Originally Posted by BigBoi

maybe because Kelsat is a ripper hackjob that has no real talent other than using the copy/paste function? just a guess.

Now you have shown yourself to be an idiot.

Go sit in the corner and listen to daddy.

Kel is more than capable than caliber is, Kel has done options in the past that no-one else has done, so your ripper comment is stupid. Im sure caliber if he was here looking at this thread would say the same thing.

So go learn some manners, and also stop advertising CH in a stupid silly way.

[Caliber]

Originally Posted by DABhand

Now you have shown yourself to be an idiot.

Go sit in the corner and listen to daddy.

Kel is more than capable than caliber is, Kel has done options in the past that no-one else has done, so your ripper comment is stupid. Im sure caliber if he was here looking at this thread would say the same thing.

So go learn some manners, and also stop advertising CH in a stupid silly way.

is this the real DAB? are you crazy? i take offense old buddy, to your statement that Kelsat is more capable than I am. I would DEFINITELY NOT say the same thing and actually am surprised that you would write this. Have you not seen the progression of trainer releases. I have not only done OPTIONS that kelsat hasn't done, I HAVE DONE ENTIRE TRAINERS that NO-ONE has done.

As for kelsat's original trainer options, what he does is download our trainers, rip our options, and then add an option here or there because I HAVE DONE ALL THE PRELIM WORK FOR HIM. I don't always have time to add 10 options to a game right off the bat, since I am working on 10 TITLES AT ONCE plus PATCHES. If you notice I will go back for the bigger titles and add more options to them.

I have no real problems with other trainer makers and people making trainers. However Kelsat is a big exception because he takes our trainers and rips them, even the intentional coding mistakes we put in them. THis has been debated many times before, but it's the factual truth. They even admitted that they stole code within cheatengine.org forums (if the postings are still there).

If you think that Kelsat is a more capable trainer maker than myself after the hundreds and hundres of titles i have worked on, many of which were practically UNTRAINABLE (but I did it), then we have some big differences of opinion and I am somewhat confused and surprised to say the least...

it takes a little work to reverse someone else's option and then put out your trainer 5 days later with 'more' options, but don't put that sort of trainer making in the same league with people who make their own from scratch (and have it available within hours of game release).

best,
Cal

PS: thanks for the nice comments from members and if you are reading this KELSAT then enjoy your undeserved 15 mins of fame off of our back. once we figure out your account with us you can bet you won't be getting our work any more...without our trainers you are nothing... also note our subscriptions are up over 100 percent this year, LOL, even in this down economy! i hope you are enjoying all the zero dollars you are getting for your releases that you are trying to cop as your own. you enjoying the late night hours for free? have phun!

[Caliber]

Originally Posted by asadl

Hey guys as the subject indicates itself the problem can any one help or any one else encountring this problem trainers tried but not working are:

Burnout Paradise
TC Endwar
Mirror's Edge

our CH burnout paradise trainer is free in like 3 days:

http://www.cheathappens.com/cheat_in...?titleID=14884

for TC ENDWAR if you have D2D version , it's free:

http://www.cheathappens.com/cheat_in...?titleID=14925

our Mirror's Edge trainers are all free:

http://www.cheathappens.com/cheat_in...?titleID=14499

notice also that we are supporting these titles through all the patches.

have a nice day-

best,
Cal

[DABhand]

Originally Posted by Caliber

is this the real DAB? are you crazy? i take offense old buddy, to your statement that Kelsat is more capable than I am. I would DEFINITELY NOT say the same thing and actually am surprised that you would write this. Have you not seen the progression of trainer releases. I have not only done OPTIONS that kelsat hasn't done, I HAVE DONE ENTIRE TRAINERS that NO-ONE has done.

As for kelsat's original trainer options, what he does is download our trainers, rip our options, and then add an option here or there because I HAVE DONE ALL THE PRELIM WORK FOR HIM. I don't always have time to add 10 options to a game right off the bat, since I am working on 10 TITLES AT ONCE plus PATCHES. If you notice I will go back for the bigger titles and add more options to them.

I have no real problems with other trainer makers and people making trainers. However Kelsat is a big exception because he takes our trainers and rips them, even the intentional coding mistakes we put in them. THis has been debated many times before, but it's the factual truth. They even admitted that they stole code within cheatengine.org forums (if the postings are still there).

If you think that Kelsat is a more capable trainer maker than myself after the hundreds and hundres of titles i have worked on, many of which were practically UNTRAINABLE (but I did it), then we have some big differences of opinion and I am somewhat confused and surprised to say the least...

it takes a little work to reverse someone else's option and then put out your trainer 5 days later with 'more' options, but don't put that sort of trainer making in the same league with people who make their own from scratch (and have it available within hours of game release).

best,
Cal

PS: thanks for the nice comments from members and if you are reading this KELSAT then enjoy your undeserved 15 mins of fame off of our back. once we figure out your account with us you can bet you won't be getting our work any more...without our trainers you are nothing... also note our subscriptions are up over 100 percent this year, LOL, even in this down economy! i hope you are enjoying all the zero dollars you are getting for your releases that you are trying to cop as your own. you enjoying the late night hours for free? have phun!

Hmmm Are you sure about this?

From what I seen, Kel managed to get a few options on TLR before you did Cal..

Either way, as you know im protective over trainer makers, and BigBoi who I think I know who it is now, who originally came in and did his thing like in Gamefaqs, so I protected.

Still if you have proof im all ears buddy.

[DABhand]

Seems this is true, and Kelset and H4x0r are ripping injection/shifting routines from others trainers.

Empire perhaps it would be best if you removed them, like other sites have so far, It will dent GCW rep if you host them I think.

[Caliber]

Originally Posted by DABhand

Seems this is true, and Kelset and H4x0r are ripping injection/shifting routines from others trainers.

Empire perhaps it would be best if you removed them, like other sites have so far, It will dent GCW rep if you host them I think.

sorry to get so upset dab, my friend. only a few things set me off and this is just one of those topics. thanks for your response and apologies if i cut you the wrong way and went a little too far- you are one of the few unpartial people out there with no particular agenda, as well as a helpful poster on these forums....

best,
Cal

[Caliber]

here's a message i am passing along to you from Chris at CH:


starts here:
-------------

Unfortunately this is the very reason why we have stopped sending our trainers to be hosted by GCW. We do not want to be associated with a site that knowingly supports and encourages the likes of Kelsat and h4x0r that rip trainer options from us and other groups. We feel that it’s extremely disrespectful to those people that are doing all of the hard work to bring this content to your visitors every day. This list includes, but is not limited to Veggy, Brewers, sheep, Cal, DAB and others. I’ve personally spoken to several of these people (they contacted me) and it’s a real shame that GCW is quickly losing the support of the truly talented trainer makers out there in favor of rippers like Kelsat.



I’ve attempted to speak with Empire about this issue and I know that others have as well, but it always seems to fall on deaf ears. It’s very unfortunate as we have sent many a visitor this way in the past whenever a no-cd fix is needed. I’ve also done personal favors for Empire without a second thought when he’s asked. I guess the content that people like Kelsat and h4x0r provide is more important than long-term relationships that have been established with the core trainer community and the reputation of the website.

ends here:
----------------

another example of the kelsat continuation:

wheelman trainer- we had our trainer out since tuesday. he has his trainer out late yesterday with the SAME options (except he added the useless stamina option so you could RUN forever in a driving game... lol). anyways calling the option 'vehicle nightmare' instead of 'carnage mode' like in our trainer doesn't make it any less of a ripoff of our trainer. also note that he hijacked the same INCORRECT code spot for the vehicle life as our ORIGINAL trainer, which we just updated today to take in account of the missions using a different method. what a loser-

just another example for empire so he can know why he's losing ours and others support when Kelsat gets bored, or gets a job or whatever and he has no one left to supply his site with content... as for us another record month of signups! thank you members for your support of our site.

look for (unsupported) copies of our last 4 or 5 trainers when he gets an illegal scene copy of the games. nice! lol.

best,
Cal

[DABhand]

Why do I feel like a big bullseye lol :\

[Joe Forster/STA]

@Caliber: If you ask me, GCW aims - or should aim, if possible - for quality rather than quantity. (We've been running the forum with this more and more in mind for the last few years.) If you (or Chris from Cheathappens) describe the situation to me in a PM or an E-mail (preferred) and I understand them, I'll try to forward them to Empire in my own words. I assure you, he's not a malicious guy but 1) it is hard to make decisions on opinions only - yours is one, some other person's is also one - and 2) he has so damn few time that even I can hardly contact him for forum-related reasons.

[DABhand]

If my word means anything, I have checked coding between trainers and even some non-challant/useless code is identical.

If you see from start of thread, I gave Kel the benefit of the doubt, then when told he has been ripping options I looked into it myself and it is true.

Even if say caliber and no-one else does a trainer for a game for 2 weeks, guarenteed 2 weeks neither will kelsat. And now he is building a false reputation of being a trainer maker when all he is doing is ripping coding via Olly.

I can point a finger at a couple of people who did tuts on this, but ultimately they are not the ones doing it.

Its like doing some hard work and when you go get paid for doing it, someone comes along and says they did it and gets your money.

[Joe Forster/STA]

For filtering, I would like to get the exact list of trainers that are stolen or the exact list of trainer authors whose trainers are all stolen.

[Caliber]

i appreciate your responses and thoughts Joe, but that's impractical and probably impossible. We don't disassemble EVERY trainer from other trainer makers and test them all. It's only the ones that come out immediately after hours with the same exact options, then we look further and see if the code locations are the same, etc. then we might put in dummy code or have to repair and option and see that the other person's trainers have the same code as our old option. we are too busy and have too many things to contend with than to spend even more time trying to explain and prove this all over again. we are too busy to come in here and have a dossier of files, code chunks, and whatever 'evidence'. we are done with that. i would have thought that the word of ourselves, several other trainer makers (who really aren't friends of ours but still agree about kelsat), and the fact that they wrote that they were ripping our options in a posting on cheatengine.org themselves!

if you want to put kelsat's ripped work above ours then we can't participate here. i think that is what chris is trying to say up there-

also, it sounds like you are questioning the quality of our trainers? is this in comparison to kelsat's, specifically. in light of what we have been saying and what we wrote here, i am disappointed to hear that and this further erodes our relationship here.

at any rate, i don't want to turn this into something more than just a decision to cease ties due to intolerable decisions by the site owner, who has every right to make any decision he wants, just as we do for our own site and own purposes.

thanks again for at least acknowledging and replying but i don't see any progress in this and at this point i don't expect to.

best,
Cal

PS: I don't know what DAB means by having a target on him, but he has nothing to do with anything going on here, although i appreciate him looking at the trainers and etc. and making his own informed statements. I hope nobody blames or thinks of him any differently.

[DABhand]

Hey chris can I get a big hammer to smack neo7 with, why does he pick on me all the time >.<

What he did the last time got me annoyed if you remember :P

[Joe Forster/STA]

Look at it from our point. I don't know about Empire, but although I'm a professional programmer and a hacker myself, I don't know much about today's copy protections or how to train today's games. (I've done that in the past, for DOS games, but not anymore. No time, no interest.) As such, we can only make decisions based on incoming reports. As haven't been using trainers for years - actually, haven't played a game for many months now; it's like sex after the nth X: you can't do it but you don't mind it much anymore either -, I don't even know the groups creating them. Now, how should I know which group is ripping off the work of which group? Scene groups are always sending fuck offs to each other in .nfo files, for real or not so real reasons...

However, as CheatHappens is a well-established maker of trainers, perhaps, a simplified way of reporting thieves should be the best compromise: if you can name us those people/groups who often rip off your own works, those could be banned from GCW. (That's not a promise, just a recommendation that I could forward to Empire, if you agree!)

However, it may well be possible that Empire will request something in change. Let me guess: e.g. a discount on CheatHappens membership for our forum members; special GCW releases of your trainers and/or trainers uploaded to GCW before other sites. Please, consider these, too. (Again, these are only my own ideas, without knowning anything about Empire's standpoint on this whole matter!)

Originally Posted by Caliber

also, it sounds like you are questioning the quality of our trainers?

Hell, no! I cannot question something that I haven't even seen...