Ultimate Trainer; The One. Could it be done?

[DTJango]

Something I've been wondering about is why no one has made an attempt, at least an open one, at making an ultimate trainer. Yeah, I know, some have the title "Ultimate" or "Mega", but I mean like THE trainer. Or at least a program to access and download trainers in an easy-to-use interface.

Essentially a Steam of trainers where you can go through, download and update with just a couple clicks.

I'm sure it's possible, but do you think it's crossed the minds of any major trainer maker?

[Joe Forster/STA]

Niiice, I love integrated solutions!

I think the major problems lies in having a unified program architecture. (Unless we're talking about only an automated downloader that can identify games, either by a running process or by having the user point to the main executable.) I would prefer a constantly updated engine that interprets scripts from text files. (Unencrypted text files. You can "steal" them but what's the point when everyone knows where they initially came from anyway?!) Older scripts would either get updated for newer engines or the engine backwards compatible forever or the engine containing multiple major versions all-in-one (see newer DirectX). This would also mean that adventurous users can also develop and distribute their own trainer scripts.

Wait... I think I invented... tada... Cheat Engine: The Next Generation!

[roberthall]

That sounds fun! How many games do you have though, that you need a super trainer? Anyway, I think the main problem with a "Steam for trainers" is that someone would need to host the master trainer archive. And unlike the video game industry, the internet community is nowhere near as well organized or trusting.

Now, if you're talking about a single program that includes like 50 different trainers for various games, that seems like a cool idea. Imagine the complexity of programming something like that! I would like to see that though!

[Joe Forster/STA]

Originally Posted by roberthall

And unlike the video game industry, the internet community is nowhere near as well organized or trusting.

That's hilarious! The internet community gave us GNU/Linux, the video game industry (not the actual video game developers!) game us Safedisc, SecuROM, Star-Force and Tagès. The video game industry is so paranoid that they trust neither developers (ripping them off with like 1-2% of the full profit, recently rejecting game ideas that are not movie tie-ins or sequels) nor customers (invasive copy protection). True, true, the video game industry is organized, though... against everyone else.

[roberthall]

They're justifiably paranoid though, considering how many people enjoy pirating their software, and how many people have fun bypassing said security methods. It's not just the PC makers either, Nintendo came up with a form of protection on their NES.

Besides that, the greed shown by the video game companies isn't exclusive to them. It happens in all of the economic world from farming to microprocessor manufacturing.

This sicheats/cheathappens is a prime example of the paranoia and divisiveness I'm talking about. The two of them are making it that much harder to access trainers, making an "All-in-One" trainer that much harder to make.

[Grumpy]

The figures regarding piracy are over exagerated.

Yes piracy is a problem but just because somone pirates a game doesnt mean they were ever going to buy that game in the first place. They pirate it cause its there, not cause they are trying to save money.

For example, and keeping it simple, lets say 1000 people pirate a certain game but only 100 of them were ever considering buying that game. So the developers/publishers are not losing 1000 sales they are really only losing 100 sales, yet they tell you they have missed out on 1000 sales.
Most only pirate a game for the hell of it, not because they ever intended to buy it.

[roberthall]

Well regardless of why people intend to pirate software, the fact is they do. Copy protections were created to stop people from stealing software, not because EA doesn't want Activision to copy them.

[Joe Forster/STA]

Don't believe everything that the mass media tells you. Actually, don't believe anything the mass media tells you, without giving it a second thought, as their values are seriously warped.

(@DTJango: Sorry about hijacking your thread. If you're annoyed, PM me and I'll split the thread into two.)

[DTJango]

It's no problem to me. I like when a thread takes a sudden, interesting direction, especially a debate.

On the trainer subject:
@roberthall
Originally, I started thinking about it like a single program that included many trainers, where maybe I'd just use a dropdown menu to activate the trainer I was wanting. Then I thought about it more and the "Steam of trainers" thing came into my head, where you could browse for a trainer to download so you wouldn't have to have dozens that you didn't need, the ones you had would automatically update (with the option to disable the update for a particular game and download an older archived version) and the possibilities just kind of grow from there.

On the current subject, starting after the trainer:

I agree with roberthall about the internet community is not organized or trusting (or trustworthy), but that doesn't mean something amazing can't come from it. As Joe Forster said, GNU/Linux is a big'un.

What usually needs to happen is just the right person with the knowledge and time to do it. That's about it.

The internet is an insanely open place and with that comes some obvious dangers, but some great benefits. When the production of something is driven by a community, not investors, it becomes an open project where everyone has a voice and, ideally, the option to modify the final product as they see fit.

Linux is a great example of this as it's open-source and those with the knowledge can tweak it how they want. Same goes for the video game industry when a game is open for modders. It benefits both the developer and consumer and it's a practice that should be adopted by all devs, in my opinion.

For example, ARMA II. Do I care about the game itself? No. It's not my thing. Did I still pay $30 for it and the expansion so I can play DayZ? Hell yeah.

The video game industry is a profitable one, though, and that brings the need to expand profits by any means necessary with spending the least to do it which brings in DRM.
Sales numbers prove to everyone that piracy pretty much never hurts a publisher, but it's seen as withholding potential profits. Why make $1 million, when you can make $1.1 million? That's an extra $100,000 that most likely won't go to pay anything extra to the hardworking developers, or add a nicer parking lot for the company, but it looks good on paper and appeals to investors.


(Sorry for the awkward segue to and from the internet openness and the piracy/industry subjects. I'm in a bit of a rush)

[darkedone02]

it can be possible, the only "trainer" that came closes to this was actually MT-X but you have to download a new version everytime they update and add in new cheats, and most of their trainers don't support the pirated version of games. If Joe got the time, cash, and knowledge, he MIGHT go ahead and develop one... and release it in Feb 2014 maybe.

[Grumpy]

Originally Posted by darkedone02

... and most of their trainers don't support the pirated version of games.

... and so they shouldn't. We dont support piracy either, no-one should!

[Joe Forster/STA]

Originally Posted by darkedone02

If Joe got the time, cash, and knowledge, he MIGHT go ahead and develop one... and release it in Feb 2014 maybe.

You sound ironic but I have even worse news for you: I got none of it. I gave up cracking and coding trainers like a decade ago; now I do serious work as a job as well as a hobby.

[darkedone02]

Originally Posted by Grumpy

... and so they shouldn't. We dont support piracy either, no-one should!

believe it or not, they do. H4x0r uses the crack files to make his trainers, if you look at most of it. it requires Skidrow Cracks or Theta Cracks, Razor1911 Cracks, and other pirating scene groups out there. Even there are some trainers out there that also works with both the pirated and legit versions like LinGon, Fling, and other trainer makers out there. The only trainer maker's that does not support piracy of any of their trainers is MT-X.

[darkedone02]

Originally Posted by Joe Forster/STA

You sound ironic but I have even worse news for you: I got none of it. I gave up cracking and coding trainers like a decade ago; now I do serious work as a job as well as a hobby.

such a shame...

[Grumpy]

Originally Posted by darkedone02

believe it or not, they do. H4x0r uses the crack files to make his trainers, if you look at most of it. it requires Skidrow Cracks or Theta Cracks, Razor1911 Cracks, and other pirating scene groups out there. Even there are some trainers out there that also works with both the pirated and legit versions like LinGon, Fling, and other trainer makers out there. The only trainer maker's that does not support piracy of any of their trainers is MT-X.

Oh I use cracks but I buy the games. I use the NoCD Cracks so I dont have to listen to the disc spinning all the time whilst playing, its a hassle using the discs all the time and the cracks allow me to store the original disc for safe keeping.
However, I do not use trainers of any sort. I like the challenge of games so dont want a trainer to make it easier or to cheat. And yes I do understand some of the trainers give you some extra benefits but I am not interested in those.
Its like all the 'assignments' you get with games like Battlefield 3, they dont interest me at all, I just like to run and gun and shoot people ..... only in a game of course.
So just because someone uses a crack, doesnt mean they support piracy.